Question:
Bundy vs. Bundy II
Hi All;
I'm a new sax player and have some questions on the Bundy and Bundy II saxaphones. I was not in the band in HS (late 70's) but I had friends who were and seem to recall that Bundy was regarded as a good horn. Can anyone provide any positive or negative feedback on Bundy?
And what is a Bundy II? Is this a next gerenation improvement or is this a case where the company sold out and an inferior horn is now being made under what used to be a good name?
Thanks!

Answer:
I am sure that you can find plenty of information on the internet on Bundy and its history and commercial links (not many in the way of quality I am afraid...) with the Selmer factory in France.
The reality is Bundys are decent student (Bundy II) or at the very most goodintermediate intruments (Bundy), the Bundy bares more than some similarities with the Buescher Aristocrat and it is a good , simple but well built sax. The Bundy II is , I am afraid, a very poorly built horn. Some features have modernized this horn like the LH group but frankly speaking if you press too had on one of these keys you are likely to bend them (and can be bent back just as easily..). Adequate for schools and marching bands, you will soon want something better that a Bundy II, while Bundy is a definite keeper (if you don't get too sofisticated)

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Hi Milandro;
Thanks for getting back to me. That clears it up.

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It clears it up only if Milandro is correct - I'm not sure I would agree with his assessment. I had both a Bundy (wire key guards, left-hand bell keys, and an Aristocrat 200 (Bundy II equivalent w/modern key guards, right-hand bell keys). Both horns had equivalent sound and keyboards handled equivalently, but the 200 had better intonation (probably just set-up). I kept the 200 and even record and gig with it. The Bundy is sold. Your experiences may be the same or different. I say play them both and go with the one that plays the best for you.

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As for the Bundy II, we rented a tenor for three months for my son. Compared to a pro level horn, the keywork and action were a bit stiff, but the intonation was fine and that sax had a really great tone. I had a couple of other players try it and they were equally surprised. I still regret returning that horn.
I agree with Knighttrain. For any horn, whether pro or student, play it and then go with what works best for you.

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I must admit, I am not a great player or a music intrument guru but in my not too short life have owned a fair amount of horns and played even more.
The impression I had was that The Bundy I was a nice instrument very inspired upon the Buescher Aristocrat, as I previously said. When I came across the Bundy II I wasn't impressed . Of course this is a personal Judgement, which I believe to be the only way to judge anything. I would strongly recommend to seek both instruments and make up your mind with a hands on approach.
If anything this idea that the Bundy i is better than the Bundy II (although it is not , by all means, a sure way to make up your mind about anything) is shared by many, hence the rather higher price on the second hand market of the older Bundy than the newer one.
There is no absolute truth, just relative ones.... .

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I don't believe I have ever seen a "BUNDY I".
The french bundy saxes are not student horns, and in a different class entirely from the bundy II horns.

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I simplified giving the name Bundy I to the Bundy in order to make a better distinction with the Bundy II.
There are no French Bundys, Selmer, is the brand you refer to. had something to do with Bundy (please look at the reference on internet) in the past but largely Bundy is only using a Brandname, Selmer, which is a completely different cup of tea.

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Originally Posted by milandro
There are no French Bundys, Selmer, is the brand you refer to.
You're correct, there were no french Bundy saxes. I was thinking of VITO while posting on bundy.

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I could do with some clarification here and, with respect, one or two others could as well. I have the feeling that there were three distinct Bundy models - German (Keilwerth?), French (Beaugnier?) and American (Buescher derived from the later Aristocrats under Selmer USA ownership. Selmer Paris does not come into the equation at all; it is a completely separate company.
The Bundy II - a.k.a. Buescher Aristocrat 200 and Buescher 400 (in later guises) - was a later (1970s) student design from the outset. Not bad of its type, but generally reckoned to be inferior to the Selmer Bundy.
Any information on the earlier models would be appreciated.

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I am quoting from Selmer France own site:
"...From 1895 to 1910, Alexandre Selmer served as principal clarinetist with the Boston Symphony Orchestra, Cincinnati Symphony Orchestra, and the New York Philharmonic Orchestra. At the turn of the century, a small retail store was opened in New York City for selling the family wares. Selmer clarinets prospered after winning a gold medal at the Saint Louis exposition of the 1904 World's Fair. In 1918 Alexandre returned to Paris to assist Henri in their growing family business, leaving an employee, George Bundy, the rights to distribute Selmer products in the United States.Having a firm hold on the professional clarinet market, Bundy next set his sights on flutes. In 1920 Bundy hired George W. Haynes, the first in a family famous for flute making, to design the Selmer flute. These fine instruments bore the brand names “Original Haynes” and “Master Flute”. In fact, Selmer flute manufacturing was briefly moved to Boston, site of several famous flute companies.
Louis Lot flutes became the rage with professionals in the late 1920s. Selmer responded by offering a copy of a Louis Lot owned by Charles Selmer (first flutist with the Opera Comique and the Concerts Colonne Orchestras). To cement Selmer';s position in flutes, Bundy brought a young flute craftsman named Kurt Gemeinhardt to the United States from Markneukirchen, Germany.
Bundy recognized the need to leave New York City in order to expand his manufacturing operations. By the 1920s Elkhart, Indiana, had established a reputation as the band instrument capital. Drawing on a skilled labor pool, the company was moved to Elkhart. A New York showroom remained open until 1951.
In the 1940s, Selmer entered the piano market, purchasing the Jesse French Company of New Castle, Indiana. The division was closed in 1954 to concentrate on band instruments.
American industry in the 1940s prospered from advancements in efficient and economical production methods and the newly developed field of plastics. Selmer combined these factors in 1948 to produce one of the first commercially successful molded clarinets--the Bundy Resonite® model 1400. The 1400 was patterned after the famous Selmer (Paris) BT clarinet, used by such great artists as Benny Goodman. The Bundy Resonite clarinet launched a revolution in affordable, high quality musical instruments and established Selmer as an industry leader. The 1400 passed the one million-units-sold milestone in 1978 and continued to launch musical careers......"
So the bonds were there.
In reality Selmer America and Bundy were a company producing low level horns in America and re-selling the famous Selmer made in France.
To add to the confusion the Brandname Selmer has been used as Selmer England, Selmer New york, and a few others which are easily found on Internet.
At the moment the company comprises a number of brandnames and it is called, I believe, Conn-Selmer.
When it comes to Bundy saxophones all this becomes academic.
They are really simple saxes which changed several features as the company bought in other companies (at one time I had a sax case marked Bundy on one side and Buescher on the other and it could be used for both makes...which were, in fact, one brand) the Bundy is a Buesher-like model.
The Bundy II borrows some resemblance to the Selmer France in the LH group which is based (but not copyed) on the " Real" Selmer stuff, since they had the rights to that design anyway. A more technical writer could go in the details I suppose.
All of this information is available on internet with just a little effort

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Yes, it was Henri Selmer's brother Jean who set up Selmer USA to sell Selmer Paris instruments. Yes, Selmer USA (now Conn-Selmer) retains the selling rights. No, there is not a direct ownership connexion between the two companies nor manufacturing connexion either.
Selmer Paris remains just that; Selmer is owned by Steinway and still is since the merger (takeover?) of the previous Conn owners (UMI, who purchased the company in 1985).
As for similarities, try any Asian sax and you may see similarities with Selmer Paris models (essentially SA80); the rest are mostly copies of Yanis. I think it probable that all are copies of something.
In reality Selmer America and Bundy were a company producing low level horns in America and re-selling the famous Selmer made in France. Exactly so, but this does not establish any connexion of ownership.
the Brandname Selmer has been used as Selmer England, Selmer New york Selmer New York was the US company. Selmer England I am less sure of; I thought it was a marketing arm of Selmer Paris, but am by no means certain.
The internet is a wonderful thing .. when used correctly. For example, try this link: where you will be able to read the following (my italics):
Conn-Selmer, Inc. is the leading manufacturer and distributor of band and orchestral instruments for professional, amateur and student use. The Company manufactures and distributes its products under a variety of well-known brand names, including Vincent Bach brass, Selmer USA woodwinds, C.G. Conn brass, King brass, Armstrong woodwinds, Ludwig and Musser percussion and Glaesel string instruments. Other brands include Scherl & Roth and William Lewis & Son string instruments, Emerson flutes, Benge brass and Artley woodwinds. Under its Leblanc, Inc. division, purchased in 2004, the company also manufactures and distributes Leblanc, Holton, Noblet, Vito band instruments. Conn-Selmer is also the exclusive North American distributor for Selmer (Paris) professional brass and woodwinds and U.S. distributor for Yanagisawa saxophones.
Sometimes, a little extra effort is needed.

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In a Nutshell:
Yes, Bundy is horn name that was used by many different horn makers, which can make identifying them very complicated. Commonly you can find them made by Conn, Buescher, Selmer Paris, and Selmer USA. Some were made by Keilwerth with the name Bundy Special. Most Bundys are student/ intermediate level horns at best, but many people seem to agree that the Keilwerth made Bundy Specials are pro level horns.
IMO, the current production Bundy II horns we have are excellent student horns, well built(like a tank!), rugged, comfortable to use and reliably in tune for a beginner.

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This thread may be of interest:


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Hi everyone;
Thanks for getting back to me. I appreciate the help and insight.