Question:
An alternative to Vandoren B40 Mpc?
My teacher who I have recently started taking lessons from wants me to change to a more orthodox mpc (my current clarinet mpc has a wide (75) tip opening).
He loaned me his spare B40 which has a good sound, but feels restrictive in that it squeaks if I try to blow loud, so I have to back off a bit. Can anyone suggest any alternatives to the Vandoren B40, which I like except for the restrictiveness.
I could stay with the B40 and try to get used to it, but now seems to be a good time to try other pieces as well. I was also wondering how some of the mpc's recommended here previously e.g. Grabner, Eddie Daniels, Morgan would compare with the B40. Thanks.

Answer:
Hey Ken, my wife, the clarinet player prefers a B45. I think they are both too restrictive and for that reason and others I prefer a Ralph Morgan RM15. It really makes changing from alto to clarinet that much easier.

For my bass clarinet though I'm luvin' the Grabner LB which makes me think some of his soprano clarinet pieces might be interesting to give a try.

Answer:
The B40 is a good mouthpiece but does not focus easily. It tends to be spread and that is the not the "ideal" in the clarinet community. I've been working with a teacher who plays in a major city orchestra to get my clar chops up. He immediately had me switch from my B40 to a Vandoren M15. The switch has been amazing. The M15 has a thicker core and is focused and centered with little to no effort.
The RM15 is not all that different from the B40. They share a similar tip opening. If your looking for a similar tone of the B40 but the focus and ease of play of an M15 try the M30. The M30 was designed with the B40 in mind, only using a more traditional facing and tip opening.
There are a lot of good mouthpieces out there. But there is a reason why almost all the city orchestra performers are on the M15.
While some sound excellent on a B45, it is generally thought of as a "shrill" sounding mouthpiece in the clarinet ommunity. That type of mouthpiece works well in a Sousa March or similar style. It is a lot of work to darken and focus the B45 enough for symphonic work. Though, many are successful doing so. The B40 works well in both styles as it is definately not shrill...but can be a bit "wooly" or "suffy."
Check out the M15 and M30. They are both "typical" and standard mouthpieces that work well in every setting jazz though symphony

Answer:
I've become deeply impressed with the Walter Grabner Kaspar-style K14 on Bb soprano clarinet. I have a great love for the clarinet to begin with. But, now with the K14 it's become downright addictive. I get the same level of enjoyment and amazement with the K14 as I do with the Grabner LB on bass clarinet. I highly recommend a try out. Walter Grabner has a good return policy so if you don't like the mouthpiece you can return it for a full refund (minus $5 shipping).
The quality of sound I get with the K14 is stunningly beautiful. It's big, dark, round, and very warm. Response and articulation are almost effortless. Equally impressive is its level of projection. All jazz clarinet mouthpieces I've tried over the years use brightness as the means to project. Somehow, Walter figured out how to project a DARK sound. The Frank Kaspar style design probably has a lot to do with this. Now, I no longer struggle to be heard in my big band. With the K14 my sound projects beautifully even in the clarion and bottom range. This truly is an extraordinary mouthpiece.
Roger

Answer:
It seems as though the B-45 is considered a beginners piece. I'm not familiar with the B-40.
How does it compare to the Vandoren 5RV lyre?
I used to use a Vandoren 5JB Jazz piece until I switched to a Morgan J6 Jazz model.
I'm not really a classical player, but more of a dixieland and Jazz player.
this set-up (with Vandoren Blue box 3.5's reeds)really projects for Artie Shaw and Peanuts Hucko type tunes. Great for doubles!
Greatest Jazz Clarinetist??
Buddy Defranco, but I still love Pete Fountain.
That M-15 sounds nice.
I'll have to check it out.
Roger, I'll have to check out the Grabner Pieces!!!

Answer:
Originally Posted by king koeller It seems as though the B-45 is considered a beginners piece. No. For example, (afaik) Guy Deplus played B45 for many years of his professional career (if you don't know him, he is one of the better classical clarinet players from France).

Answer:
The B45 is often thought of as a beginners piece because so many band directors pushed that mouthpiece in the 90s. As King stated, the B45 is designed by and for a professional.

Answer:
I often remind myself that everything about our equipment and our personal preferences toward our equipment is entirely relative. Much depends upon us as players, our particular oral cavity construction & "internal resonance", our tonal conception, our particular clarinet and its bore design, the match between the mouthpiece and the clarinet barrel (very important!), the match between the reed profile and mouthpiece facing (also very important!).....the list can go on & on.....
On another thread I described how I had problems with Legere reeds on my Morgan RM28 but better results on my RM10 and then Legere reeds totally hit the ball out of the park on the Grabner K14 (absolutely stunning results). I can't help but wonder WHY? I discovered that the original mouthpiece for my 1960 Couesnon Monopole clarinet has what appears to me to be a Kaspar kind of design that's similar to the Grabner piece. Perhaps this helps to explain why the K14 turned out to be such a good match for me on that clarinet. But, get this.....
My Patricola C clarinet is designed for Bb clarinet mouthpieces. Since I had such remarkable results with the K14 on Bb I assumed that it would sound equally great on my C clarinet. Wrong! It was a dud!! My Morgan RM10 works beautifully for me on the C clarinet. Why the difference? It's not that one mouthpiece is any "better" than the other. BOTH the K14 and RM10 are superbly designed and crafted pieces. Rather, for whatever reasons the RM10 works better for me on the Patricola C clarinet...with its particular barrel and bore design.
I had a similar experience last night that reminded me again about how all of this is relative. I have a plastic Yamaha clarinet that I described on another thread. It sounds shrill with my RM10 and RM28 mouthpieces. However, it sounds MUCH BETTER with my K14. Wanting to further refine my sound, I ordered one of Phil Muncy's barrels -- the Black Diamond barrel made from a synthetic material. According to Phil Muncy, the barrel should improve the sound of my plastic Yamaha. So, I tried the barrel with the K14 and frankly it didn't do anything for me. The K14 sounded better with the original Yamaha barrel. Feeling let down, I was going to return the barrel for a refund. However, an intuitive hunch came to mind and I tried matching the Muncy barrel with my RM10 mouthpiece. Lo and behold, it sounds really GOOD....much better than with the K14 on the original Yamaha barrel. So, here I have two perfectly excellent mouthpieces and one of them works much better with the Muncy barrel than the other. My head is spinning! ha ha ha
It will take someone smarter than I am about the subtle nature of clarinets to explain the WHY of these experiences in matching mouthpieces, reeds, barrels, bores, etc. Never the less, when I find an equipment match that is especially good for me that's what really matters. After all, I don't think about my equipment when I cut loose in my big band. All I want to do is to PLAY and have a great time at it.
Roger

Answer:
Thanks for the suggestions.
I decided to email Grabner and Fobes, and so far Grabner has recommended trying a K14, so I may try that against the B40. Interesting to note that the B40 is a relatively open piece (1.19) compared to the K14 (1.08)
I will let you know which mpc I end up with, but I agree with Roger, everyone's different.

Answer:
Eternal,
I was concerned at first about the 1.08 mm tip opening of the K14. Especially, as I had been using a RM28 -- which is 1.28 mm. But, Walter suggested that I don't think about the tip size and just get into the feeling of the mouthpiece. It took me a couple of days to get used to the K14. Then, it felt 100% comfortable to me....like I've been playing on it for years. I'm still amazed at how easy blowing it is and how it has such a big and projecting sound. For me, it's in a different league than other mouthpieces I've played over the years that had a similar tip size.
Please let us know how you come out. Good luck!
Roger

Answer:
Roger, what Legere reed strengths are you using on the K-14? On the RM 28, 15 and 10?

Answer:
The difference in tip opening between my main and backup (bass clarinet) mouthpieces is 0.30mm. I just use slightly softer reeds with the backup. It is very possible you will like several mouthpieces, but not necessarily ones that are close in tip opening (or something else). Don't worry about it too much. Just try different strength reeds until you find reeds that match. Then comes the really hard part, deciding if you like it better than what you previously played.

Answer:
Retread,
When I spoke to Walter Grabner prior to ordering the K14 he suggested that I use a #3 Legere. I would have thought a 1.08 mm tip would need a stiffer reed. But, Walter does something tricky to the K14 facing and a #3 Legere Quebec works perfectly fine on it.
I had also been using #3 Quebec on my RM28. However, I would often make an adjustment to the reed tip with the ATG Reed Finishing System to make the reed more responsive on that set up.
For whatever reason, I felt most comfortable with the RM28 rather than a RM15 or RM10 -- prior to getting the K14 -- on my 1960 Couesnon Monopole. It's important to understand that a Couesnon has a perfectly cylindrical upper joint which is different from the polycylindrical bore that's commonly used in modern Buffet and Leblanc clarinets (probably Selmer too). My Couesnon also has a larger bore size than a R13. It seems to me that a cylindrical bore has somewhat less resistance than a polycylindrical bore. This might help to explain why I felt a better match with the larger size of the RM28 on my clarinet. When I tried a RM10 on my Couesnon I used stiffer Quebec reeds in the #3.25 or #3.5 range.
I use #3.25 Quebec with the RM10 on my Patricola C clarinet.
Roger

Answer:
Just an update on the two Grabner K14 mpc's that Walter sent me. I was surprised to find that they were both brighter than the Vandoren B40. Also I said above that I found the B40 to be a bit restrictive, but I think I am getting used to this mpc now.
The B40 I'm playing is actually my teacher's backup mpc (It was his main piece until recently when he thought it didn't play so well, possibly due to warping). He prefers the B40 to the B45 because it is darker. When he heard me play both the B40 and K14 he also thought that the B40 sounded darker. Also for me the K14's were noticeably harder to play in the altissimo range (above double-high A), but maybe that is just a matter of adjusting to the mpc.
My setup is a Selmer Series 9 (full-boehm) with Mitchell Lurie 3 reeds and a standard ligature. I thought my findings may be different on a commonly used reed like a Vandoren 3 so gave that a go. What I found was that it was harder to pick a winner in terms of darkness when using the Vandoren reed. The K14's may have had better projection. However I found I got a brighter sound for both mpc's than with the Lurie.
So, since I am after a dark sound, the B40 was the winner, especially when using Mitchell Lurie reeds.

Answer:
Mitchell Luries run kinda soft. A 3.5 would be more comparable to a Vandoren (blue box) 3. Maybe moving up a half strength would help with the altissimo....though I rarely play above double A!

Answer:
Eternal,
Several suggestions for simple ways to darken and improve your sound on a K14:
1.) Try a thicker cut reed such as a Vandoren V12 or Gonzales FOF. The thicker profile (based on the old Morre reed) will darken your sound and give it a stronger tonal core. The Legere Quebec reed I use has a similar thicker cut. I tried Lurie reeds several years ago and they didn't do anything for me. I discovered that I need a Morre-style reed in order to get the darker, thicker sound that I want.
2.) Try a Vandoren Klassik string ligature. I'm deeply impressed with how beautifully the Klassik works on my K14. It really brings out the naturally dark and warm sound of the Grabner Kaspar-style mouthpieces while, importantly, also enhancing projection. My sound is actually bigger with a Klassik than with a Masters ligature. I'm absolutely sold on the Klassik.
3.) Try taking in more of the mouthpiece into your mouth. When my lower lip is placed on just the right spot on the reed -- where the reed breaks away from the mouthpiece's facing curve -- my sound is in The Zone. Whereas, if I take in a lesser amount of the mouthpiece my sound isn't as vibrant. It's likely that a B40 and a K14 have different facing curve lengths. If this is true, then you'd need to make an embouchure adjustment with the K14 and the placement of your lower lip on the reed.
4.) Talk with Walter Grabner about how you're not happy with the tonal color you're getting with the K14. He may be able to send you ones that are darker. In the case of my 2 LB bass clarinet mouthpieces, he sent one that is considerably darker than the other. I'm sure that Walter will work with you so you'll be happy. Just let him know.
5.) When trying different mouthpieces it's critical that you have a teacher or trusted musician buddy listen to you at a distance in a large performance space as well as in an ensemble....rather than just close up in a room. I've heard friends have a sound that was fine close up; but, it was a different story when I walked to the back of the performance hall and listened carefully to their sound. It's my personal feeling that a Grabner mouthpiece will have a more vibrant projected quality of sound than a B40 as how it's heard in the audience. But, try it out for yourself in a large performance space and see how it goes.

Roger

Answer:
Originally Posted by Roger Aldridge 1.) Try a thicker cut reed such as a Vandoren V12 or Gonzales FOF. The thicker profile (based on the old Morre reed) will darken your sound and give it a stronger tonal core. The Legere Quebec reed I use has a similar thicker cut. I tried Lurie reeds several years ago and they didn't do anything for me. I discovered that I need a Morre-style reed in order to get the darker, thicker sound that I want. My 14 day trial ran out today, so I had to send the mpc's back. I will give those reeds a go though on my existing setup. When selecting a mpc I tend to try to find one that plays well on my current setup, rather than trying to change my setup to fit the mpc. Actually I switched to Luries on a suggestion from a previous teacher to get a darker sound than Rico Royals. I also tried Vandoren Blue Box but they were still brighter than the Luries. They seem to work for me.
Originally Posted by Roger Aldridge 3.) Try taking in more of the mouthpiece into your mouth. When my lower lip is placed on just the right spot on the reed -- where the reed breaks away from the mouthpiece's facing curve -- my sound is in The Zone. Whereas, if I take in a lesser amount of the mouthpiece my sound isn't as vibrant. It's likely that a B40 and a K14 have different facing curve lengths. If this is true, then you'd need to make an embouchure adjustment with the K14 and the placement of your lower lip on the reed. Taking more mpc into my mouth is what my teacher told me to do as well. So I that is something that is an ongoing thing with me at the moment.
Originally Posted by Roger Aldridge 4.) Talk with Walter Grabner about how you're not happy with the tonal color you're getting with the K14. He may be able to send you ones that are darker. In the case of my 2 LB bass clarinet mouthpieces, he sent one that is considerably darker than the other. I'm sure that Walter will work with you so you'll be happy. Just let him know. I did notice that one of the K14's was darker than the other. I was surprised at how different the two mpcs were. I guess I could give him my feedback and see what he suggests. I'm kind of sold on the B40 though.
Originally Posted by Roger Aldridge 5.) When trying different mouthpieces it's critical that you have a teacher or trusted musician buddy listen to you at a distance in a large performance space as well as in an ensemble....rather than just close up in a room. I've heard friends have a sound that was fine close up; but, it was a different story when I walked to the back of the performance hall and listened carefully to their sound. It's my personal feeling that a Grabner mouthpiece will have a more vibrant projected quality of sound than a B40 as how it's heard in the audience. But, try it out for yourself in a large performance space and see how it goes. Ideally I would have liked to try the mpc in a real world situation as well, but I ddn't have any playing opportunities on clarinet during the 14 day trial.
Thanks for those suggestions.