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I just finished watching Alien 3 for the first time in ages tonight, and have to say, it's not a bad film!
The direction is lovely, the alien doesn't look *too* bad, and I thoroughly enjoyed it!
So, why does everyone rip into it? Does anyone else feel it's a great film?
-Chris
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Cause it's following two masterpeices of cinema ..............................
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I too enjoy alien 3, a few little annoyances reguarding the dodgy effects here and there but apart from that i thought it was a fair job, it was doomed to take flak the minute it was made really seeing as though it was to follow on from alien and aliens, two masterpieces in most peoples opinions :D
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You're right it's miles better than that overblown blimp masquerading as a sequel to Alien - and there's plenty of pretty intelligent touches to it. I dunno - I think that it fell between the expectations of the Aliens fans and the Alien fans...
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It's the second best of the quartet - a vast improvement on the awful "Aliens" and worlds apart in both quality and intelligence from "Alien Resurrection". The scene between Weaver and Charles Dance in the sickbay is the best single piece of acting and writing in the whole series and the imagery is constantly extraordinary. It doesn't entirely work but it's packed with provocative and stimulating ideas. Best of all, there are no marines spouting macho nonsense at the top of their lungs.
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Originally posted by unrealnils
Cause it's following two masterpeices of cinema ..............................
Exactly. Alien 3 is a dud.
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The marines in Aliens reminds me of US troops in Iraq.
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Where both Alien and Alien3 work better than the other in the series is that the protagonist is a single virtually indestructable Alien.
In Aliens and Alien Ressurection they basically die to easily, removing all sense of menace and turning them into a mere splatterfest.
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The marines in Aliens reminds me of US troops in Iraq
Indeed, especially the friendly fire incident in the incenerator, which was spookily accurate to real life ;)
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In some knowledgable interview at the time, it was even descibed as an allegory of the Aids virus... having something inside you can't control... what do you do about it.
I liked A3, other than the dodgy sound levels.
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I loved Alien 3!
I've probably watched it the most out of all the films. Then Aliens, then Alien and then Alien Resurrection.
But I'd put them in this order of which ones I liked:
1. Alien
2. Alien 3
3. Aliens
4. Alien Resurrection (which I didn't like at all. But I only saw it on a dodge VHS *early release*. Would like to give it another go.)
Even thought I loved Alien 3, I've always wanted to see the full version. Ever since seeing the advert and seeing some extra scenes, which weren’t in the final cinema release, I've wanted to see the longer version. Bring on the Alien 9-Disc DVD set this year!
Alien 3 opened my eyes to widescreen films as well. I had the fullscreen version on VHS and near the end of the film, there is a shot of the planet and it was stretched and oval!! When I finally got the widescreen VHS and saw that it was corrected and was round, I tried never to get fullscreen videos.
Psycho :nuts:
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I really liked Alien3 - it's very different to the others though, a lot more dark and brooding I thought. I guess that's Fincher for you though, eh? (It was Fincher wasn't it?)
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Originally posted by shlunk
I really liked Alien3 - it's very different to the others though, a lot more dark and brooding I thought. I guess that's Fincher for you though, eh? (It was Fincher wasn't it?)
It was Fincher. :thumbs:
I also like the fact that it was in a prison with not many wepons like guns. Makeing it harder to kill the Alien. I also liked all the English actors, the sets and the whole look of the film.
All this talk is maknig me want to watch it! But I'm going to hold back untill the longer version comes out on DVD.
Psycho :nuts:
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i hate the fact they kill off the main characters from aliens2, it taints my enjoyment of that film knowing they may as well have died anyway!!
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i hate the fact they kill off the main characters from aliens2, it taints my enjoyment of that film knowing they may as well have died anyway!!
Aye that is my main gripe with Alien3, the way it just threw the three surviving characters from Aliens out straight away :brickwall I can understand them having Bishop die (if thats the right word) cos he was wrecked, but they could have built alot around Ripley's relationship with Newt and then maybe killed her off later in the film (which would have crushed Ripley alot more cos she would think that she had replaced the daughter she lost and then it would be snatched away from her again).
Anyways Alien3 is not a bad film in the slightest, more misunderstood by alot of fans (me included) but hopefully this new cut on the Quadrilogy boxset will flesh it out and tidy it up a bit more :)
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I thought getting rid of the bland Hicks and the foul brat was an excellent move myself.
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I think Alien3 is a brilliant film which is better still when not comapred to the others.
Alien Ressurection is also a fine film which starts brilliantly and then for stops for me when we see the pregnant alien queen. That "milky bar" alien as my friends and I called it was terrible.
Back to Alien3 :) , considering what fincher had to go through for his first film, script rewrites by the day, the ending had to be reshot at the last moment, Fox took the film away from him and finished editing etc, I do hope we get to see something closer to his version in the up and coming dvd set.
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I haven't seen Alien 3 for years, but at the time I saw it at the cinema I recall it was just a 'slicker' clone of the original, and not as good. There was no *heart* in this film, unlike the first two. It was just empty.
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I think there's a lot more 'heart' than in the other two. Ripley's character development is deeper and more touching - she dominates this film without having to be either macho or maternal -and the scene between her and the Doctor is an extraordinary moment of emotional truth. It's also full of strange and beautiful concepts, some of which come off and some of which don't - but when it does work (the moment where the alien embryo looks like a human foetus on ultrascan for example) it's a brilliantly ambitous piece of science fiction.
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Once you get past the absolutely AWFUL idea of killing Hicks and Newt, which totally deflates the ending of Aliens, Alien 3 is pretty decent for about an hour. The build-up is good, Sigourney Weaver is fine as ever and there are nice supporting performances by Charles Dance, Charles Dutton and the late, great Brian Glover. Unfortunately once Dance and Glover are knocked off, it goes badly off the rails and descends into endless scenes of sweary, lookalike bald convicts who you couldn't give a toss about being chased by a ropey-looking alien (effects are fine in close-ups but the scenes of the beast running are poor). The ending... well, you can't help feel moved by Ripley's sacrifice but again it's negated by the knowledge she steps out of Victoria Principal's shower... I mean she's resurrected through her DNA. Not a dead loss but the first two films stand head and shoulders above it.
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Originally posted by Ol' Blue Eyes
Once you get past the absolutely AWFUL idea of killing Hicks and Newt, which totally deflates the ending of Aliens, Alien 3 is pretty decent for about an hour. The build-up is good, Sigourney Weaver is fine as ever and there are nice supporting performances by Charles Dance, Charles Dutton and the late, great Brian Glover. Unfortunately once Dance and Glover are knocked off, it goes badly off the rails and descends into endless scenes of sweary, lookalike bald convicts who you couldn't give a toss about being chased by a ropey-looking alien (effects are fine in close-ups but the scenes of the beast running are poor). The ending... well, you can't help feel moved by Ripley's sacrifice but again it's negated by the knowledge she steps out of Victoria Principal's shower... I mean she's resurrected through her DNA. Not a dead loss but the first two films stand head and shoulders above it.
The novel was great. I wished they'd followed that more closely.
I have a strange fondness for Alien 3. It's kind of intelligent and TBH I didn't hate the killing of Ripley.
Alien 4 is also very good up to a point and we all know what that point is!
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Originally posted by CLH
Alien 4 is also very good up to a point and we all know what that point is!
1 second into the film? :|
Alien 4 should never have been made, not with that awful script anyways. The cast, the plot, Ripley turning into a badass, the awful human/alien mess. Ugh - and that's coming from a huge fan of the first 3. I like the underwater chase stuff, but that's pretty much it.
It would have been better if they never killed off Newt and Hicks in Alien 3, then kill off Ripley at the end with Hicks, Newt and others as the lone survivors. Bloody dark ending to the series, but would have been fitting IMO - the Alien finally got to her numerous escapes from the beast.
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When I first watched Resurrection I hated it, on repeated viewings it became my favourite except for that awful "Newborn". If they'd just given Gieger the money to draw up a new kind of Alien it could have been fantastic. Oh, of course they would have to have removed Winona Ryder, but that does apply to every film she's in. The underwater chase was excellent.
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Originally posted by HBK757
1 second into the film? :|
Alien 4 should never have been made, not with that awful script anyways. The cast, the plot, Ripley turning into a badass, the awful human/alien mess. Ugh - and that's coming from a huge fan of the first 3.
It would have been better if they never killed off Newt and Hicks in Alien 3, then kill off Ripley at the end with Hicks, Newt and others as the lone survivors. Bloody dark ending to the series, but would have been fitting IMO - the Alien finally got to her.
Sorry!! Up to a critique point rather than a time point (although the time point downwards spiral is obvious).
There is some excellent stuff in there but of course it has to suffer because of some of the mistakes made in 3 as well.
Ripley survives because of marketing men of course. The best post modern irony would have been to take a male actor to best the Aliens in Alien 4. Certainly there is some merit to that and it would free them from the shackles of histopry.
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It would be nice if a "hero" didn't survive through film sagas. ie - if Ripley died in the 3rd film and the 4th film focused on some of the other survivors. Takes all the suspense out if you know they're going to survive.
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Maybe I should rewatch Alien3 but at the time it came out I remember being deeply disappointed. And I loved the first two films.
As for part 4. It needed a new spin, but just found an excuse to bring ripley back and repeat the original.
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Resurrection is at least 'a change'. Alien³ just feels like a re-telling of the first film to me, and never reaches the same level. It's pretty much the classic 'cash-in' sequel, the sort of film that you would have expected to follow on from the original Alien.
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Alien Resurrection is like Alien Lite. It's entertaining and watchable and has some good scenes and characters but it's just another wisecracking action movie and it's not remotely scary or suspenseful.
PS - Has anyone read the rejected scripts for Alien 3? I've read 3 - William Gibson's cold war movie on a space station, David Twohy's hi-tech prison movie (neither of those star Ripley) and the original Vincent Ward one with the monks on an artificial world made of wood, which I'd thought was a joke till I actually read it.
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Perhaps any new films should go for the comic book route. Not aliens vs predator though because as James Cameron put it, thats scraping the barrel of two franchises. (IIRC)
Surely we can have new stories with new characters that happen to come across the alien species. But then we'd end up with the general public moaning that the films are crap because ripleys not in them. :(
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Originally posted by Ol' Blue Eyes
and the original Vincent Ward one with the monks on an artificial world made of wood, which I'd thought was a joke till I actually read it.
I like Wards films and while I agree his initial idea sounded bizarre it also seemed pretty interesting and original.
How did the script read?
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I love the Gibson one, it takes the whole Alien/Aids thing a step further. As well as getting one inside you from a facehugger, you can also "catch" alien through spores. It's just that untill now nobody has lived long enough for it to take effect, as the gestation period of the infection is quite long. Got rejected 'cos Ripley (who stayed alive long enough for the infection to take hold) died in the first ten mins. Can't see Weaver loving that.
wide
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Hiya
Notice alot of discussion about the Aliens legacy here.
I'm mod on an Aliens discussion board and we'd welcome new members :wave:
http://driddle.co.uk/phpBB/index.php
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Originally posted by CrazyHorse
I like Wards films and while I agree his initial idea sounded bizarre it also seemed pretty interesting and original.
How did the script read?
IT was very dark, but the whole wooden world thing had it's own internal logic and made sense. I think I read that it would have been too hard to film, and basically all we got from it was the monks (although even they are prisoners in the Fincher version). I preferred it to the version Fincher was forced to make.
You can get all the scripts off the web.
I think the chances of a directors cut of 3 are nill though, as Fincher has said he wants nothing more to do with it. My problems are :
The killing off of the 3 characters at the beginning (although apparently they killed off newt mainly because she was too old by the time they filmed it). As mentioned - it weakens the ending to 2.
You're never given any time to care for most of the characters, in fact they are mostly unsympathetic, and so you don't really give a stuff when they meet their end.
The massively overblown death scene for Ripley - I mean - she falls for miles into that couldron, and in the cruciform shape! Ram it down our throats why don't you :)
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Originally posted by Ol' Blue Eyes
Once you get past the absolutely AWFUL idea of killing Hicks and Newt,
In purely practical terms, killing off Newt was probably necessary given that Carrie Henn would have changed considerably in the six-year time-lag between <I>Aliens</I> and <I>Alien 3</I>.
Of course, they could always have cast someone else - but I suspect people would have been equally outraged at that!
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I too really like Alien 3, I have the boxset in front of me but am putting off watching it because I want to see the Directors cut (I know I have to wait until November). Alien 3 was under-rated in my view, it has a good story but I think people were just annoyed because they killed Hicks! ;)
Top Cat
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Alien 3 Directors cut has been made :)
This is from the VERY reputable www.digitalbits.com
Quote from the information about the site new book - The Digital Bits: Insider's Guide to DVD
"Best of all, we'll show you exactly how much work is involved in putting together your favorite discs, by taking you behind-the-scenes on what promises to be the biggest DVD release of 2003 - 20th Century Fox's 9-disc Alien Quadrilogy box set! We'll give you an insider's view on the making of the set - the audio commentary sessions, the interviews, the creation of the new cut of Alien 3 and more. You definitely don't want to miss it!"
See new Cut :clap: to say I am happy about that would be a huge understatement
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Doesn't say Director's Cut though - just a new cut.
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I know Fox can be gits and it is possible that they could do another version of the film without the Director (man would be be annoyed!) but I think it is more likely that he would be involved (well we have to hope so!)
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This has, like, been discussed before (http://Here.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=174691), dude.